Putting your life back together after a criminal conviction
Chance Oberstein’s California Corner in this Registry Matters podcast is about putting your life back together after a criminal conviction. It's relevant for everyone, and for Californians, it's especially important.
Source: Registry Matters | About Chance Oberstein
Transcript
Andy: California Corner! Take it away, Mr. Chance, in that corner over there. Ding-ding-ding!
Chance: Okay. In The California Corner, we're talking about Putting the Jack Back in the Box. As I listened to the questions and thought about this, it's really relevant in terms of everyone, and for California, it's really important. So, putting the jack back in the box is really talking about how you get your life back together after conviction. And I'm going to put it in the context of, say, a conviction for a crime involving a sex allegation. So everybody knows this in California, and I'm not sure about the rest of the world, but there is no Department of Rehabilitation in California.
And by the way, gentlemen, if you want to jump in and ask a question, anytime, I'm always open for one. Okay?
Larry: I got a question for you right now. You said there's no Department of Rehabilitation. I thought it was The California Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation!
Chance: Uh, heck, no! That doesn't mean anything. As you know, theories of punishment change now and then. We have never been a state with rehabilitation as our main purpose. It's punishment. And if I haven't said it, again: it's punishment, and I'll say it a third time: It's punishment! There is no Department of Rehabilitation and the Department of Corrections is a misnomer, so that should clear up that little thing.
Now, to achieve rehabilitation for a criminal conviction in California, you must rehabilitate yourself. And a lot of folks will ask, and it's important that they do, when does the process start? Because that is a very smart question. It has universal application, but let's start at the pre-plea: What is pre-plea? This is what happens before you plead guilty or no contest. This is the time when you can show the court, and whomever else is interested, and hopefully the prosecutor is, if they're willing to do justice in a case, you can show them that there's a recognition of the issue. Now, how do you go about doing that, even if you don't know what the issue is?
Well, one is psychological services. Let's take, for instance, getting a forensic evaluation and risk assessment. A forensic psychological evaluation plays a crucial role in the criminal justice system, by addressing important questions and providing valuable insights for legal proceedings. In the context of sex crimes, they can be used to assess criminal responsibility and evaluate risk for future dangerous behavior. This information may be crucial to the appropriate settlement or disposition of your case. And I say that, and I emphasize it, crucial. Also, sex therapy. Say you're pending the disposition of your case, and you want to do something proactive that is going to help you down the line, including the possibility of a better disposition. Sex therapy, going to a therapist and talking about what the issue or behavior is.
The main objective is to help the individual subject of the therapy to avoid risky, aggressive, or reoffending behavior, high risk situations. And that sounds like a really good idea if you're pending a case outcome. So, it's a good idea. Now, other things can be used as well to benefit you, like Sex Addicts Anonymous. Just like if it were Alcoholics Anonymous, a fellowship of individuals who share their experience, strength, and hope with each other, that they may solve their common problems and help others to recover, that's a good place to be, pre-plea.
Now, let's talk about Post-plea: Post-plea has to do a lot with probation. Now, there's only really two things to know, and I don't need to emphasize them, because I think everybody knows and understands them. Comply with all the terms and conditions of your probation. That's easy. Maybe not easy to do, but easy to understand. And show good conduct while on probation. Which means, don't violate, don't pick up a new case, don't do things like that, okay?
Post-probation: Now, if you finish with probation, and you were able to do these pre-plea things, and on probation, you were able to comply with all the terms and conditions of your probation, then we're talking about what you do when probation either terminates or expires. Well, this is the most important thing I'm going to say tonight - continue to work on the underlying issues that caused the behavior. It's really, really important. And it is important because it will achieve your objectives down the line, in order to reintegrate, and to normalize, and stabilize your life in the future. For example, additional sex therapy or continuing fellowship in Sex Addicts Anonymous is really, really important. But other things are important as well. Things that we all know, like employment, because work provides an opportunity to build friendships and connect with colleagues. Additionally, executing tasks you're good at can stabilize your mood, especially if you're prone to depression. And a lot of folks who have been convicted and have to register are prone to depression.
Education. The most important aspect of education is personal growth, which contributes to your discernment and maturity, which helps you avoid what you got caught up with to begin with. Social groups, and I think this is really important as well. It's well established that people who feel socially isolated, or as though they don't belong, have worse mental health than those who feel socially connected. So, getting involved with groups, social groups like including close friends, religious congregations, health and wellness groups, volunteer networks, and human rights organizations, is all very, very, very helpful for your mental health. And it all helps you move along that rehabilitative trajectory.
Andy: Chance, I just want to chime in. Like, all of those, I don't want to say all of those things are "restricted" for our people, but many of those things are restricted, or challenging, for many of our People.
Chance: Correct.
Andy: And that just makes it incredibly hard. I mean, yes. Those are all great things that probably every therapist, treatment provider, any of those professions would recommend that you do. But, "Oh, I'm sorry, you can't go..." you know, like the app Meetup, that just has the "volleyball pickup group" or cycling group, or the chess club, or whatever movie group. "Oh, I'm sorry, you can't be on that app." Well, like, what do you want me to do? "Sorry, you should have thought about that before you committed your crime."
Chance: Yeah, that's legitimate, that's a legitimate comment. But, if you think about it, these social groups that I've mentioned are not all-inclusive. As a matter of fact, there's a million things you can do, okay? And there's a million places you can go, and you don't need apps.
Andy: Agreed.
Chance: You know, what I'm saying to you, and what I'm saying to everyone is social groups are important. Find one you can belong to. And if that social group is like a therapeutic group, like Sex Addicts Anonymous, then stick with them. And if that group is another group like a church group, or another group like a human rights organization, or a resource group like this one, join it! Because all of it has meaning, and all of it is important.
Larry: So, I would like to expand on the point Andy was making, that a lot of people are forbidden. Probation invokes this so-called "felon association" clause. And they say that you can't do these things in these groups because "they're felons." Like, they won't let them attend the NARSOL conference. "There are felons there." They won't let them attend things because there are felons there. And it's like, really? I will guarantee you there's hardly a church that you could go to, that has more than 100 members, that doesn't have a felon in the congregation. So, if you take that to a literal, extreme interpretation, you would never be able to associate with anyone, because in any group you associate with there are going to be felons. And I think that's something for another conversation one of these days, about this over-interpretation of the "felon association" clause by supervising authorities.
Chance: Yeah, I think that's legitimate, too, except for one thing. With probation, I don't go into that, and I'll tell you why. Because I'm so busy complying with all the terms and conditions, and showing good conduct, I might not have time to do exactly that. This part of what I'm talking about is post-probation, which means you've already finished with it. So, once you finished with it, that's the time to really connect, because I understand exactly what you're talking about, and it's the most difficult thing to do. But if you asked me, "When does the process start? At pre-plea? At probation? At post-probation?" I'd say, if I want to get that answer right, "All of the above."
And then, once I've engaged in those things, and it doesn't have to be every single one, but a good many of them will help. I'll show you how they work. How do I document my process? Before I do show you how they work, memorializing your efforts and progress is essential to meeting your legal objectives at a later stage of rehabilitation. Otherwise, what do you have to show for it? Like, you'd be the invisible man! Organize the following areas of documentation, and keep them in a safe place where they can be easily located: like psychological evaluations, risk assessments, progress reports about sex therapy and probation, self-help, additional therapy, fellowships, all that stuff. Keep a file. Keep it safe. Keep it so you know where to find it.
So, this is how you use it: How do I make my rehabilitative efforts and progress work for me? Now, this is where you're going with this. And where you're going with this in California is right here, at legal objectives. Termination of probation. Judges will consider granting your petition for early release from probation if you have met the following eligibility requirements:
Fully paid all your court fines and restitution.
Completed community service hours.
Don't have any new arrests or pending cases.
Not on probation for another case.
Completed at least half of your probation period.
Successfully completed all obligations, such as court-ordered classes and counseling.
So, look, if you meet these eligibility requirements, and they should sound familiar, since we've touched on almost every single one as we've gone through this, the court should grant early termination of probation, if your good conduct and reform justifies the action. And typically, this means that the court believes that you're not a risk to public safety – sound familiar? — and you're moving your life in a positive direction, which means the rehabilitative trajectory. Second of all, once you achieve that, let's just say you achieve termination of probation - dismissal. If a defendant has completed probation or has been discharged early, as mentioned above, they can petition to withdraw their guilty plea or no-contest plea and enter a plea of not-guilty under Penal Code section 1203.4. That is just an incredible, wonderful thing that California offers. On top of which, if you're successful at doing that, you can move on to reductions.
If you successfully either got your probation terminated early, and/or get a dismissal which says you completed it without violation, that goes far in helping you achieve a reduction. A defendant can request a reduction of a felony conviction under certain circumstances. As we've discussed in prior episodes, this typically occurs after either early termination of probation, or dismissal. The court has the discretion to determine whether to reduce your felony conviction to a misdemeanor, under Penal Code section 17b. The court will consider several factors in determining whether to reduce your conviction from a felony to a misdemeanor, including:
The nature and seriousness of your offense;
But, more importantly, your behavior while on probation or under court supervision;
Your prior criminal record; and
Any other mitigating or aggravating factors in your case.
And all the things I mentioned before go into mitigation. So, it's almost built for you to achieve reduction.
Furthermore, if you're on the list, and that's the context of what we're talking about right here, sex registrants can petition for removal from the California sex offender registry based on the tier of their offense. To be suitable for removal, individuals must not pose a threat to public safety. All that work that went on before, all that stuff goes into that very standard. And if you achieve that, that's wonderful. But, regardless of that outcome, there's always a Certificate of Rehabilitation, which we've talked about in prior episodes, including the last one, which is a court order that indicates that someone who was convicted of a felony, or a listed misdemeanor sex crime, and served time in state or local prison, has been rehabilitated. It doesn't erase your criminal record, but can offer benefits such as improving employment or housing opportunities, or help when applying for professional licensure from the state. All these things have a common thread, and they all tie in with each other. They're all rehabilitative. And they all, all build foundationally on the other. And that, if I were the Department of Rehabilitation, would be a form that I would put down, and have everybody look at and understand, before they went out and started, from day one. So, gentlemen, what do you say about that? What do you say about rehabilitation in the Great State of California?
Larry: Well, I say that I continue to be intrigued about that Certificate of Rehabilitation. I would like to have that in our state. And I'm also intrigued by reducing your crime after the fact, showing your rehabilitation, that you can have a crime adjusted downward. Is that what you were talking about, "a wobbler"? Or is that a different thing? Because we talked about a wobbler, last episode.
Chance: Right. That's a crime that can be charged either as a misdemeanor or a felony, which is called a wobbler. And if it is a felony, yes, it could be "wobbled down" to a misdemeanor, which is incredibly wonderful.
Larry: But in terms of the reducing the severity of an offense after rehabilitation, are there...? I'm guessing there are offenses that are excluded altogether, that just aren't eligible — would that be correct — that you can't reduce?
Chance: Yes, that would be correct. But one interesting thing about this, in terms of reductions, people think that there's a time limit. "Hey, I can only do it, you know, during a specific time." Well, there was a case called Meyer. It's a 1966 case [247 Cal.App.2d 133 (Cal. Ct. App. 1966)] and I often have brought it to court, when a prosecutor says, "Hey, wait, it's late in the game. That was ten years ago." Uh… no. It can happen at any time, any time after probation expires. And that is such a cool thing that, you know, it's not limited by time or space. I just love that.
Andy: Well, someone in chat says, "Chance is making California sound like a great place to commit a PFR-type crime! It sounds like there's actual rehabilitation, which you don't hear about in most states."
Chance: Well, that – I mean, I'm not so sure you'd want to commit anything here. But I will say this: This state, even though it's been overshadowed by a lot of stuff, is still a very progressive state in terms of rehabilitation. And I think that, when you look at this, when you look at it from the overhead view, it's very impressive!
Larry: Well, you certainly are way ahead of us, in terms of what we're doing. I would really like for us to have that Certificate of Rehabilitation, and I'd like to figure out a way to incorporate it for people who have non-New Mexico convictions as well. Because if you've lived decades and decades of exemplary life here, but you're from Mississippi, Mississippi is never going to pardon, or expunge, or do anything for you. So, you shouldn't be saddled with your "Mississippi baggage" for the rest of your life.
Andy: Mississippi would be one of those states where they would do Judge Dredd type things and, "Oh, hey, you jaywalked. Sorry. Death."
Chance: Not cool. Not cool.
Larry: Not quite that bad, but I would like to figure out how to expand the opportunity. Now, I know the argument is going to be that we'll become a haven for people running from their past. That's the pushback that we'll get. But there's got to be some balance that you can do, to make sure that we don't become a Mecca for that, but also give people that have legitimately moved here... maybe what we would do is that they'd have to have lived in the state for a certain number of years. That way, you don't have the people coming just for the opportunity to try to apply for that. If you've been a New Mexico resident for ten years or something, then you can apply for a Certificate of Rehabilitation.
Chance: That'd be nice.
Larry: So. Well, are we recording an episode next week?
Andy: Probably. I would think that we would record next week, and then there's the conference after that, and then, who knows, after that? I got nothing I can say about the 29th and then forward.
Larry: Okay, so we are on next week. Alright, sounds good.
Andy: I believe so. Well, very well. Let's do – Larry, what are these two "good news" things? — And then we will wrap it up.
Larry: Well, the two good news things are about voting, I think. Nebraska has restored felon rights. They've removed the two-year waiting period. So, you get off supervision, complete your obligations. And then it looks like that Pennsylvania has made it where people who are incarcerated can vote. And I didn't dig deep enough into that, but if somebody from Pennsylvania wants to dig into that, we can get further into it. But it looks like they're going to let – they're going to join those liberal-lefty-states like Vermont up in the northeast, and I think Maine, where they let people who are incarcerated vote.
Andy: Cause that's not what the title says. It says, "who have been incarcerated." That's not: "who are incarcerated."
Larry: Oh! Well, thank you.
Andy: I mean, that's the way the title reads. I'm just, so these are just people that have been out. Maybe they're still on supervision of some kind, whatever. They can vote.
Larry: Okay, well, let's see. That's the Philadelphia Inquirer. It's good news that everybody says, "I can't vote," and they pretend like they can't influence public policy. But you can vote, in many instances. You can vote and you just don't realize it.
Andy: Yep. And that's where people go around to typically minority-type neighborhoods and get out information drives to let people know that they very well might be able to vote.
Larry: So yeah, that was behind a paywall. That was the reason why I didn't do any work-up on it. I couldn't actually read it.
Andy: One of these days, Larry, we will teach you how to get by the paywalls.
Larry: Well, I don't like to …pay!
Andy: Again, I can – never mind, never mind. Simple little plug-in to the browser, and you can get by the paywalls. But uh, anywho, we had new patrons! So, thank you, Kayden and Matt, who joined just before the show, and he's the one that we were talking about, the Missouri-Kansas person. Thank you both very much for joining. Kayden did a whole year-long, and Matt just did a monthly pay-as-you-go kind of thing. But that's all good!
Andy: Head over to registrymatters.co for the show notes. You can leave voicemail at (747) 227-4477, email us at RegistryMattersCast@gmail.com and, of course, as I just mentioned, support us on Patreon at patreon.com/registrymatters. Chance, I hope you survive the heat! And, Larry, I hope you survive the nice weather.
Chance: Thank you. Thank you.
Andy: I may have had that backwards, on purpose.
Larry: I'll see you next week? Maybe.
Andy: Very good. Take care. Have a great night, gentlemen.
Chance: You too.
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